Episode 8: How creating a ‘culture of failure’ fosters innovation

In this episode, Amie and Angeline sit down with Christy Sink, Head of research and development at SPC Global. They discuss the importance of encouraging a ‘culture of failure’ and how it can underpin innovation and success in product development.  

Transcript

Amie:

Welcome to Women Transforming Food, a monthly podcast brought to you by G100 and Inside FMCG, where we explore the inspiring journeys of women shaping the future of the Australian food industry. Today, I'm joined by my co-host, Angeline Acharya, Asia Pacific Chair of the Food Systems Innovation and Resilience Wing at G100 Mission Million, and our guest for this episode, Christy Sink, Head of Research and Development at SPC Global. Welcome, ladies.

Christy:

Thank you.

Angeline: 

Hello, welcome, welcome Kristy, hello Amie.

Amie:

Throughout this series, we've had the privilege of speaking with incredible women who are transforming the food system through innovation and customer experience, supply chains, sustainability, leadership, and more. Today, we delve into Christie's journey.

Christy, your career in product development and innovation has taken you from SPC to Delishu and onto well-known retail brands like Cole's and Whole Foods Market. Consistent through this time has been a deep commitment to positive change within the food system. Keen to unpack today, what early experiences or influences shaped your perspective on the power of food to impact the world and how has that vision evolved over time, particularly within the context of the FMCG landscape?

Christy:

Well, for me, my journey into food really started when I was quite young in the formative years of my teenage years. So at the time, I read a book that was really radical called A Diet for a New America, and that really focused on how our food choices can impact the environment, our health, and animal welfare. And for me, in that formative period of my life, it was really kind of life-changing to think about how the things that I ate on an everyday basis really could impact more than just me and had an impact sort of outside of the scope of just myself. I grew up in North Carolina, which is a part of the deep South of the United States. And in North Carolina, we have a really rich agricultural and sort of agricultural history and food culture. And that sort of was also just a part of my own personal DNA. 

So, you put the two of those together andI went off to be a champion to save the world and I went to university to study environmental engineering actually shortly after getting to university, I started sort of realizing that in North Carolina, which is the hog producing capital of the United States, that working as an environmental engineer meant that I would probably be designing hog lagoons for hog waste for the majority of my career. And I thought, you know, I stopped eating meat about five years ago. This probably isn't the career for me. Oh my gosh, what am I going to do? So I looked through the course catalog and I found this, this career track that I'd never heard of called Food Science. And I was like, what is this? So a bit of research later, I realized that, you know, it was combining my two sort of loves and passions. So I loved food and I had a lot of skill in science. So I put the two together and transferred tenures and found my calling. 

So I've been really fortunate that that has meant that I've been able to, you know, do what I love throughout my career. So after I finished university, I moved to San Diego, California, and I worked for a specialty ingredient company. So that was a really great base for me because I learned how to build the foundations of a product formulation and how various ingredients can really interact with one another and sort of what it meant to really start from scratch to build something.

I was working on specialty ingredients in FMCG products that went to consumers. And after a few years, I realised that I wanted to be able to really directly influence the products that consumers were consuming. I ended up landing my dream job at the time at Whole Foods Market, which was based in Austin, Texas at the global headquarters. So I was a product developer for their private label brand. So I worked across everything in the private label space. So everything from peanut butter and bag salads and frozen ready meals to dog food and shampoo and baby nappies. So I got just a tremendous breadth of experience at Whole Foods Market. 

But really one of the critical things that I took away from my time there is that Whole Foods Market is the largest natural and organic retailer in the United States and it's really a purpose driven organisation and so learning how to really think about the consumer carefully craft every single element of a product to make the world a better place was a really foundational learning experience for me. And that's something that I've taken with me everywhere I've gone. You know, I think that's probably changed over my career from sort of being idealism and wanting to change the world into how I can turn that into commercial outcomes.

For me, that might mean creating better value on a product for consumers. So it's going to make it more appealing or finding ways to make something more sustainable while also reducing costs. So that's sort of how it's transformed from just being grandiose ideas into being something that's quite practical and business led.

Angeline:

Wow, that's a lot of experience. I guess you've been a champion, not a guess, you are a champion for sustainability in FMCG, even when it wasn't as mainstream as it is today, right? And I think your backstory there just kind of showcases that. Looking back at your experience at Whole Foods and then at Coles, what were some of the most significant turning points in consumer awareness and corporate action on sustainability? What future trends do you see shaping the sustainability agenda for FMCG brands, Christy?

Christy:

You know, Whole Foods started out as like a co-op in John Mackey, the founder's, you know, garage, and it was always about sustainability. It was established in the 70s when there was a real revolution in food, you know, happening in Austin and Berkeley. And so that sort of sustainability and animal welfare and health, like that's really, that was really part of the foundations of Whole Foods as a brand. So obviously that really has flown through Whole Foods as a business.

One thing that Whole Foods is really brilliant at is educating consumers to then drive demand. So, you know, they've really been at the forefront of teaching people why something in the sustainability space is important, why ethical sourcing is meaningful, know, the lives that it directly impacts when you go fair trade per se, or, you know, they're just really great at changing the dynamic of the way people think. So, you know, it seems so kind of try it now, but Whole Foods really led the way in reusable grocery bags in the United States. So that wasn't something people even thought about, but it makes such a big difference when you think about it. And it's something we've adopted here in Australia because it's kind of been legislated that we have to, but they really did it as a kind of way to be better and do better. 

At my time at Whole Foods, probably the thing that was really exponentially growing was organics. that was just absolutely exploding and genuinely growing exponentially. And you go in any retail store in the United States now and you'll see a conventional offer next to an organic offer. I mean, that's true from Whole Foods to Walmart. Like you'll see it anywhere. And that really came from Whole Foods. Similarly, at the time, the non-GMO project verification was coming to light. And again, that's something that you'll see on almost any product in the United States now. Those probably aren't as relevant, I think, in Australia because we have probably less intense agricultural farming methods. So organic, think, has a little bit less consumer demand here. And non-GMO, obviously, we have stronger regulations than they do in the United States. But those were two that have gone from sort of being really, really niche-y to being absolutely mainstream. I joined Coles in 2011. So when they were kind of going through their turnaround after they'd been purchased by Wesfarmers. 

I would say when I joined in 2011, Coles was probably 10 years behind the United States. And it was really a sort of formative time of changing the way things were done. And so that really looked like cleaning up ingredient declarations and cleaning up products so that there were no artificial colors and flavors and introducing animal welfare policies like South Stalfrey Pork and RSPCA Chicken and MSC certified fish, just introducing sustainability policies that required recycled content and those sorts of things. So that's really become, again, the mainstream and they've really pushed the agenda. And I think we've seen the whole FMCG industry in Australia really lift their game because of what's happened across the private label stratosphere here in Australia. 

In terms of big shifts in consumer demand, I personally think that the huge shift that we saw in sort of 2019 to 2022 around plant-based. I think that was just like a global phenomenon that I don't think I've seen anywhere else. you think back and it was like everything had a plant-based claim on it. 

Angeline:

Sure did, every category had plant based.

Christy:

Even things that had always been made out of plants all of a sudden were plant-based. Everything was plant-based. And VCs were piping tons and tons of funds into all these new startups and the selection of plant-based meat alternatives just exploded, you know, non-dairy beverages exploded. It was just absolutely everywhere from retail to hospitality to P&Z. You could just, as someone that's been a consumer in that space, it just was such a significant shift in such a short amount of time. I couldn't believe it. And obviously I worked at a startup, a meat, you know, plant-based meat and seasoning startup in that time. So it was a really exciting time to be part of that, that big shift. 

I think we've seen it sort of swing back a little bit the other way, particularly with the cost of living crisis and people kind of getting back into what they're comfortable with and what they know. But I think sort of some of the principles like, can you go to a meat-free Monday or can you add more plants into your diet? I think that's here to stay. And I think that's such a great outcome for us. In terms of the future, I think the focus will continue to be on waste reduction in circular economies. I mean, we're seeing that here with like Nutri-V and how they're utilising you know, excess fruit and veg into powders and snacks. We've seen that, you know, in the United States where they're taking spent grain and turning that into snacks. You know, I think we'll see more and more of that. 

Even at SPC, we've looked at how we add value to things like our pomegranate pits when we manufacture our fresh pomegranate arils, how we can take, you know, a pith is 70 % of the pomegranate. So there's a tremendous amount of value there and it's, you know, full of antioxidants. So how do we utilise that in a way that reduces that waste into the world. 

Angeline:

So better for the bottom line as well as for the planet that at the end of the day, right?

Christy:

Exactly. That's always the goal.

Amie:

It is. All right. So you've emphasised the power of innovation, incremental innovation as well, to drive significant change within organisations. I'd love to hear a specific example from your R &D experience where a seemingly small change in product packaging or process led to a substantial positive impact. And what lessons did you learn from that experience? Because I think it's, you know, you hear about Whole Foods and how they really drove that change in terms of the reusable bags, that's not always achievable. I'd love to hear sort of that small step experience as well.

Christy:

Well, I can give you one that's a tiny step that makes a big impact. So one of the things we've done in my time at SPC is we've looked at down gauging our cans. It sounds very glamorous, but basically what that means is you take one to two grams out of a can. Obviously it goes through robust testing to make sure there's no changes to performance or consumer experience, but literally one gram might be taken out of a can. 

And when you think about, run, you know, last year we made 100 million cans across our tomatoes and baked beans and spaghetti and our beautiful tinned fruits that added up to 10,000 kilograms less steel that we consumed last year. So that actually has a big impact. And if you think about what that means from, you know, having to pull less iron out of the earth and then shipping it to shepherd and to be turned into cans, which are then filled and then shipped around the world and then recycled like the reduction in energy and just the impact that that can have.

You know, 10,000 kilograms, you know, over a hundred year history, our business is a hundred years old, like that adds up. So it's these tiny, tiny little changes that can really have a big, big impact. You know, we often talk about innovation being this disruptive game changing thing that has to change the world, but often it's the little things that when you add them up over, you know, millions of customers over decades of consumption, it actually really has quite a significant impact.

Amie:

I was just talking to someone this week actually, was more media related, but at the end of the day, you're always looking for this sort of shiny new object in terms of the latest thing, but really if you look internally, there can be some of the biggest impacts just by changing or questioning the status quo or why you've always done something a certain way.

Christy:

That’s exactly right and when you put them all together they just you know they become quite substantial actually.

Angeline:

I love that example. Any little change that creates value, amazing. So let's shift the focus to SPC Global where you are now. And I'd love to understand how it is that you're inspiring your team there to really strive to make the same level of impact within businesses. What changes, similar to the can one or any other ones that you can share about, have you achieved in your time there?

Christy:

Well, I'm really fortunate. I have just an amazing team of people. So, they are full of brilliant ideas. And for me, it's really about finding ways to unlock those ideas and turn them into actionable things that can then have a business impact. So the real critical element, I think to that is, is about creating psychological safety for your teams and creating an environment where people feel free to truly innovate and bring their wild and wacky ideas. Because, you know, it's hard to bring something crazy and game changing and that might disrupt the status quo if you don't feel like you're gonna be heard or if you can bring that idea. 

So I think that's a really important sort of foundation is to create an environment where people feel psychologically safe. I think the other thing that's really important is creating a culture of failure and that's much easier said than done. It's something I'm always working on and when you work in a big business where, you know, failing can cost millions of dollars you know, it's again, it's easier said sometimes than done. But I think one of the things I learned in my startup time, you know, startups are really good at failing and failing fast and learning and iterating. And so how can you take that mentality and bring it into like a big FMCG? And a lot of that is really about iterating more at the front end, testing with consumers, testing and learn, you know, it's worth, you know, 50 or a hundred thousand dollars at the front to test things really robustly with consumers to save millions of dollars on the back end. So it's kind of around how do you do that in a way where you can fail and be okay to feel comfortable failing. 

I had a leader say one time to me, if you're not failing, you're not trying hard enough, you're not being innovative enough. And so trying to maintain that mentality, I think is always a really important thing. For me, one of the ways that we build that safety within our team is around really creating connections and deep bonds. And so I have site-based teams. So we find ways to try to interact with each other and problem solve together. We have a Monday weekly meeting where a different person will bring a problem that they're working through and they might be able to brainstorm between the different sites, what's worked, what hasn't, try this ingredient, try this process. This is how we do it, which is quite different to how you do it, but take this learning from it.

Again, just creating those moments where we can exchange ideas. The other thing we do, like really early on in my journey, we got everyone together in Melbourne and did some ideation sessions and we're doing some team building and whatnot. But the thing that I think really helped us the most was in the evening, the first night we all got together, we went and did a pasta making course and nothing unites people like cooking together and having a laugh and getting your elbows up into some flour. 

It's just a really great way to get people together. And so we try to do those kinds of things. We'll go to the gelato shop and see what new flavors are out there to keep us inspired. We have people on our team from all over the world. So we'll talk about our own cultures of origin and what food means to us or bring stuff back from our travels so we can all try it. It just keeps those ideas fresh and helps you when you. When you can be your authentic self, then it helps you bring better ideas, I think, into the workplace.

Angeline:

I love those tips, such great things and food has such a great way to bring us all together, right? Hopefully you had some wine with the pasta as well. 

Christy:

We did, yeah, of course. Of course.

Angeline:

Great.

Amie:

Of course. Okay, so that's from your team's perspective and your journey. I'm keen to unpack for those that sort of sit outside of research and development where your role is sort of being a catalyst for change and that's part of your everyday role. How do you see other functions contributing to this culture of innovation and really being part of that change moving forward?

Christy:

I am such a big believer in cross-functional collaboration. I just think you get so much more when you have ideas coming in from different areas. So if you think about it, your sales team is talking to their customers all the time. They are the point of call for the customer who has their own insights and needs. Then you've got your marketing team who has the consumer insights and the trends and their brand plans. And you've got your R &D team who has new insights and ingredients that are new to market or claims that you could be making. And then of course you can't leave out operations who can help you think about how to make something happen. I've been in situations where operations has leveraged the defect to make a new product. 

Getting those kind of, the right people that know how to make something happen with enough differences of opinion to challenge the status quo and make you think a little bit differently and I think getting those to get people together will really help you form a robust product pipeline and really robust plans. One of the other things I really like to do when sort of thinking about core and adjacent innovation is to do a thorough market review. So getting all of your own products, getting everything that's similar out in the market, maybe bringing a few wild and wacky ideas from different categories or different markets, you know, from international and putting them out and opening the products and tasting them and talking about them and looking at the claims. 

Like that really gets people hands-on into the food and gets them thinking a little bit differently about, well, we could do this. Let's add that. If we thought about this, they're doing this. We could do that. So I think that really gets the conversation going. And then when I think about that big blue sky transformational innovation, I think that's one where you have to get out of the office again with the right people. 

You've got to have a few people that can really plant some unusual seeds and get people thinking differently or give you a bigger, more macro perspective of what's happening in the world. You know, that's where I like to bring in researchers or consultants that make you think a lot bigger and out of your box. I think you literally have to get out of the office to really be able to think in that space. And I think that helps people, you know, challenge really what they're thinking and get out of just the day to day and think bigger around how they're going to solve the world's problems and not just you know, your product today's problems.

Angeline:

I love that diversity in everything, right? And that brilliant minds from inside and outside the organisation. So let's shift our focus slightly. I'm curious based on your research, are there specific product categories experiencing rapid growth and transformation in the current market? You gave an example of plant-based before, but are the ones that you're seeing and you're kind of going, yeah, that's one to watch.

Christy:

I think beverages is one to always watch. If you think about how much changes in beverages and how it kind of is like a beacon for what's happening in consumers' minds, I think beverages is just such a fascinating category. So if I think about Coca-Cola Classic being the one that's been around forever, and then in my lifetime, it became Diet Coke, and then it became bottled water, and then Red Bull came in and really disrupted the market, and then know, sweetener technology changed and it became Coke Zero and Pepsi Max. And then, you know, we started thinking about beverages for health and it became kombucha and, you know, in the US they were drinking vinegars. 

And, you know, we've seen at SPC significant growth in our juice lab wellness shots. So people, you know, thinking about health in a different way. And I think we're also moving into people wanting a bit of joy back in their beverages as well. So, you know, you've got things like, like bubbly where you've got sparkling waters with really nice flavors. So I think beverages is one that will continue to change. It changes rapidly. I feel like every year stuff comes on and off and depending on what we even, it's very rapid and even in PNC, can be a bit different to what's happening in retail versus what's happening in hospitality. So I think that that's a really interesting one to me.

Angeline:

Great example. Yeah, it's a category I always look to as well for inspiration.

Christy:

Definitely.

Amie:

And finally, last question. What key changes are needed to further cultivate a culture of innovation and transformation within the food industry? And what advice would you offer to those working in the R&D, in this sector?

Christy:

Well, I have a mantra that all ships rise with the tide. And I personally feel like we have a responsibility to leave the world a better place than it was for the generations behind us. So I think, kind of creating that competitive environment within FMCG is a really valuable way for us to actually make us all rise with the tide. I think, you know, as other companies get better, it challenges us to be better, as things become more sustainable it makes us all think about the way we do things. So I think that's just one thing to always kind of try to build us. If we're building better products for consumers, then that makes each company have to do a little bit better. So that's one example. I think from a people perspective, I think we absolutely must include a diverse range of perspectives if we want to be innovative. 

We're really fortunate in Australia that we have such a range of cultures and food cultures and languages and beliefs and identities and not to mention 60,000 years of agricultural and food culture from our indigenous Australians. I mean, that is such a distinct point of difference that no other country in the world has. So putting all of that together and utilising those voices, I think that will enable us to create a culture of innovation that will allow Australia to be unparalleled in the world.

Angeline:

I love all those examples. I think you've hit the nail on the head. We sometimes, I think we can get stuck looking at new, new stuff. But when you actually look at our backyard and what we've got here is how do you again, amplify what we've got, but that rich indigenous history that we have, I think we haven't even started to unpack or even tap that, right? There's so much there that can be truly unique for Australia, which gives us a competitive edge at the end of the day.

Christy:

Definitely, and if you think about a lot of like the sort of emerging ingredients or things that have been really trendy like quinoa and goji and acai, those are all ancient, ancient ingredients. And you know, we have this plethora of ancient ingredients here. And again, we just don't even know much about them. Like we just totally take it for granted. So I think there's a tremendous opportunity in that space for sure.

Amie:

Thank you, Kristy and Angeline and a big thank you for listening to this episode of Women Transforming Food. If you've enjoyed this episode, feel free to like and subscribe wherever you tune into your podcasts.